14 replies to this topic

[EeL]

Now when I got back into the game last year around this time after being gone for like 6+ years, I see synchros and wonder what the hell is that all about. I hated them because of how powerful they were and now I hear people say that they're 'dead' and that Xyz monsters are way better than they are. I disagree from the duels that I've had on YVD, Xyz monsters aren't as destructive as the synchros I used to face.

So can someone explain to me how monsters that often times only get their effect once for two turns can be better than Stardust Dragon, Brionac etc? Who can use their effect multiple times without being held back by material.

[Newman]

The reason behind the saying "Synchros are Dead" is that people don't use them competitively in Tournaments like YCS', WCQ etc.

Thats why the meta this format is dominated by Xyzing decks like Dino Rabbit, Inzektors, Wind-Ups and in some cases even Dark Worlds and HEROs.

One of the main reasons, or at least in my opinion that killed Synchros was the banning of both Spore and Glow-Up Bulb.  Those two cards were splashable in any deck to provide quick Synchro summoning power and speed.  It's a shame though, I throughly enjoyed using the Plant Engine in many of my decks.

[EeL]

So two cards ruined synchro engines? What about Plaguespreader Zombie, Pain Painter, Junk whatever... I'm sure those help them. But do you think that a synchro deck vs. a Xyz deck (with Glow-Up and Spore available) would result in a Xyz win?

[Newman]

EeL, on 06 July 2012 - 12:02 PM, said:

So two cards ruined synchro engines? What about Plaguespreader Zombie, Pain Painter, Junk whatever... I'm sure those help them. But do you think that a synchro deck vs. a Xyz deck (with Glow-Up and Spore available) would result in a Xyz win?

Like I said, that was my personal opinion.  Synchro builds are definately still powerful, but when you have a decks like Dino Rabbit that abuse Laggia and Dollka to shut down a ton of plays, Wind-Ups that can loop to get rid of your entire hand and Inzektors also looping and getting rid of all your resources on the field.  This format is all about speed and how fast you can maintain field advantage and keep that advantage.  With Xyz's its very easy to do that, Synchros too but you need a "Engine" as well unless the deck is very fast by itself.

I kind of expected the Psychic Engine to be more popular this meta since Emergency Teleport was at 2 now, but who knows.  As for your question, I actually think a Xyz deck would win, since like I said earlier, Wind-Ups get rid of your entire hand and Inzektors get rid of your field advantage and Dino Rabbit pretty much stops your chances of summoning/using effects.  But you never know, anything can happen in a duel.

[storyteller]

When the new relatively over-powered archetypes are xyz-based, and the old stars of synchroing, Spore and GUB are dead, it's hard not to go into an xyz era.

So says the guy who runs 12 synchros and 3 fusions in his main deck's extra deck.

[kakashipwnzor]

Six Sams, Karakuri, and Zombies all rely heavily on synching, and they're still tier 2.

[NineTales]

I think it also has to do with the fact that Xyz's are easier to make than Synchros are. A lot of decks that never needed synchros like HERO Beat, can easily splash in Xyz monsters. The only tuner that could possibly be in those kinds of decks is Effect Veiler, but I've barely seen Veiler used for synchros.

Edited by kyuubiRasenX, 06 July 2012 - 06:43 PM.

[Rothon the Keymaster]

synchros aren't dead, they're just not in power anymore. synchro's are still very viable monsters, however Xyzs are much easier to summon since they don't need a tuner. nowadays synchro's will be seen but the will most likely also have Xyzs playing with them.

Plus as was pointed out many of the top deck types simply don't support synchro's anymore. Inzektors have no intention of synching, neither do wind ups. rabbit is built on xyz plays, heroees as always remain fusion based with splashed xyz instead of synchros now, darkworlds need nothing better than grapha, and dragons never really used synchros effectively either. put simply synchros have been outclasssed by new more broken cards, as what usually happens with konami.

So no they're not dead, they're just not the supreme rulers of the extra deck anymore. which  isn't totally bad altogether we now have more options not less. so be happy to use some interesting new monsters, and try to find ways to utilize them with the synchros you love and hate. If you didn't like synchros then perhaps xyzs will suit you better. heck they revitalized my favorite deck type. give them a try.

[Sho Shinjo]

Xyz monsters are easier to make (because you just need 2 monsters of the same level), are easier to splash and more often than not they also have effects comparable to Synchro Monsters, at least on the Rank 3 department. So who cares if your effect has limited uses? Your monster won't live long anyways: it either serves its purpose, gets negated or you win.

Also, another prominent problem with Synchros is that they need a specific kind of monster. Not only that, you also need a reliable way to Summon them without losing too many resources. Without Spore and Bulb, you either need to lose resources to Synchro Summon OR need a specific setup: as good as Junk Synchron or similar monsters might be, they can't do a thing if you don't have proper targets for their effects.

Why bother if you can just Normal Summon a monster which brings out another from the Deck or hand (which requires no other setup than not having drawn the other copies), and then just Xyz Summon either a big beater, a really awesome wall or a very versatile creature?

IMHO, that's the real problem. Before, you could effectively Normal Summon a Synchro Monster: Tengu + Plaguespreader gives you a Lv6 Synchro and a Tengu from Deck, resulting in a net zero. Normal Summoning anything and then bringing out Spore or Bulb for free meant you Normal Summoned another Synchro. The high number of low-level monsters those decks required meant that you could effectively Normal Summon a Synchro with Junk or Debris. And if for some reason you needed to -1 when performing the Synchro, you could always Trishula to even the minus, and even plus.

Even without Trishula, stuff like T.G. Striker or Earth could easily make up for the minus you received with either speed or a plus upon Summon. It's not like making a Synchro is difficult anyways: it's how you handle the game AFTER the Synchro which makes things hard. Take the Drill loop for example: it's not that harder to perform than it was before, but there are so many threats for it now that didn't exist at that time (Warning and Veiler being the most prominent) than -3'ing yourself for a Drill loop and then slowly win back your advantage isn't viable at all during most games. And that happened during that same Synchro era. Now that this applies to all Synchros, it's not rare that they've fallen of grace. Summoning them is easy, but winning from there might be not.

Xyz Summons can be effectively Normal Summoned thanks to Tour Guide and Rescue Rabbit, while stuff like Inzektors and Wind-Ups make the Xyz Summon a net zero or even a plus with their versatile effects. Synchro-based builds lost that ability thanks to the current banlist. For that matter, this is why stuff like Chaos Dragon is good: they can drop big monsters with 1 card. On their case, all their big guys have inherent Special Summon skills.

Returning to the topic. These days, if you wanna Synchro Summon, you either need a proper  and specific setup or spending actual cards to do it. The Junk Doppel combo needs a very specific combination of monsters and/or good mills/draws, for example. So far, and as much as it pains me to say this, the only Decks that can reliably Synchro Summon to become a proper threat are Six Samurais (due to their mad searching skills) and OCG Lavals (because they have like 6 Foolish Burial-like cards that can make a Turn 1 Rekindling possible, and Rekindling is already broken anyways). Other Decks that CAN Synchro usually don't because they don't NEED to.

Of course, since Xyz monsters are the new thing, this is to be expected: Konami wants people to use the new Decks, not to use the old ones they already have. And to some degree, this is okay. Heck, some Xyz monsters even help Synchro Decks! Just ask Karakuris, Samurais or Lavals.

But, IMHO, they should release some of the chains laid on Synchros a bit during the next list. Fusions just got good thanks to HERO and Gem-Knight. Rituals have seen a revival with Gishki too. It's only fair they let Synchros compete on the same stage. I don't ask for complete and absolute dominance like before, but variety is always good for a game. I'd love to see a meta where we have so many options to choose from that the actual hard choice is "what deck to pick" instead of "what to tech on this group of decks so they have an edge over the others".

[Stomach The MachoPony]

kakashipwnzor, on 06 July 2012 - 01:39 PM, said:

Six Sams, Karakuri, and Zombies all rely heavily on synching, and they're still tier 2.

Sixsams
Tier 2
Does not Compute
1.5 at the lowest They can OTK just as consistently if not More consistently than Hieratics for god's sake
also Infernity Loop

[Bedabest]

As much as it pains me to say it (I hate XYZ with a passion) but Sho Shinjo has it right. Shame really. Would love to see fusions come back for a bit though.

[Cyberlancer]

HEROs are giving fusions there revival and the same goes for Gem-Knights

[DarkBlaze557]

Stomach The MachoPony, on 08 July 2012 - 04:56 AM, said:

kakashipwnzor, on 06 July 2012 - 01:39 PM, said:

Six Sams, Karakuri, and Zombies all rely heavily on synching, and they're still tier 2.

Sixsams
Tier 2
Does not Compute
1.5 at the lowest They can OTK just as consistently if not More consistently than Hieratics for god's sake
also Infernity Loop

You just named nothing but Tier 2 decks to compare to Sams (which are also Tier 2).

[sabrestryke]

If my finances were better I'd probably have more XYZ cards for my extra deck as opposed to the synchro heavy extra deck i have now.

[Sho Shinjo]

Try to not bump topics with 2 or more weeks without replies please.

If you want to discuss this topic further, make a new topic the next time~

Topic locked.